iRacing B2O Blancpain League Race Friday night Apr 15, 2016

[Daunt]

This week the Band of Others Blancpain Sprint Series journeys to America for the first time this season to race the hilly Sonoma Raceway. The California circuit which normally hosts NASCAR among other events, is famous for it's hilly and winding bends and the tight last hairpin.

For the Cup Layout, cars won't see higher speeds for long, so I think we'll see a second track in a row where downforce will play a big role. It will still be a balance though, as high downforce cars will excel in the back half of the course, while low downforce cars will excel in the front.

Practice Session starts at 7:30 PM EST spanning 1 hour and 40 minutes finishing off with a 20 minute, inverse grid, Qualify Race.

Main Race starts at approx 9:45 PM EST with 10 minute warmup and 50 minute Race.

Grid positions carry over from Qualify Race Results.

A mandatory Pit Stop is required within a narrow 5 minute Pit Window at the 25 - 30 minute mark to take on tires only.


2016 S2 Standings:
http://danlisa.com/scoring/season_st...season_id=5307

2016 S2 Rules, regulations, etc:
http://bandofothersgaming.com/b2opra...ies-gt3-league

Open Setups:
If you have some setups, please post them here and/or in the setups thread!

Hope to see you all there!

 

[Kenadian]

Yay Sonoma!!!

Thanks for posting this Kyle.

 

[Noodleguitar]

Had a lot of fun driving here so far, it's very technical. You have a wide selection of curbs, some of them will try to kill you and others will gain you speed.

Here is a lap with 46% race fuel and the setup I'm using. It has 5 wing which I find to be high enough in warm weather.
[video=youtube;C6of499dYI8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6of499dYI8[/video]

View attachment Sonoma-Cup_custom_RACE.sto

 

[Daunt]

Nice lap noel! The Mercedes looks so planted here. But i'm sure its your driving.

I'm thinking it might be me and struggling to set the car up- but whatever it is, I'm struggling major through almost the entire track. It's a new track for me but still I did not expect to be this bad.

Weight transfer issues plagued me to start, especially through the esses, managed to dial that out, a lot of oversteer and problems coming out of the bumpier turns led to a stiffer front and softening the rear springs but still I can't seem to put the power down anywhere near fast enough.

Tomorrow the race will be a major strugglebus for me.

 

[Noodleguitar]

For me it drives a bit like Okayama, you have to slow down more than you think in the slower corners. I don't think the Audi will be able to keep up with the Mercedes through the sweeping sections and at the first right-hander at the bottom of the hill. But it should be a missile coming out of the hairpins.

 

[Daunt]

I don't think they're anywhere near the same. I tried my Okayama set, mainly because I was so incredibly comfortable in it, and tried adapting it and just couldn't get anywhere. Each change would screw something else up, whether it be weight transfer, oversteer and other issues.

It's much bumpier and the Audi is struggling with that and rear grip in a lot of sections.

I'd be curious to see what you Mercedes guys can do in the Audi - mainly because of my own lack of knowledge at this track.

 

[Kenadian]

Jon was actually faster that me in the Audi last night although our times were pretty close. Hopefully he's in League tonight as his set seemed a bit more stable than yours did Kyle.

 

[Kenadian]

OK guys I'm probably going to try something a bit different tonight in setting up the sessions and the grids.

Essentially, every Friday night League equates to 3 hours of Practice/Racing over 2 Sessions.

Tonight, I'm going to create 3 Sessions with the first being Open Practice only.

The lap times from the Open Practice will be inverse Grid for the Second Session which will be 40 minute Practice and 20 minute Qualify Race.

Main Race will be grid from Qualify Race as normal.

Those who cannot make the 1 Hour Practice Session running 7:30 - 8:30 PM EST will be automatically placed at the rear of the grid.

...

The reason for this change is to deal with an issue where quick low iR Drivers are gridded higher in the field when compared to Drivers of similar pace.

...

PLEASE NOTE: If you do not feel like gridding at the front of the field you can always opt out of doing so by communicating in Teamspeak. Inverse Gridding is only a tool to keep the field closer together but it only works when all Drivers are comfortable in their Grid Position.

 

[Daunt]

That's good to hear, I'll be happy to try his set out. That's one of the downsides to a small league with open/shared setups. The guys that drive a car by themselves (for example, if I'm the only one it the RUF) I automatically have a disadvantage -albeit a small one, unlike the Mercedes who have 5-6 guys all working together to create a set.

Just pointing out one of the downsides as something to ponder about. I still think we're better off with open and the number of different winners has really shown that. There's always the forums and such to get setups.

As for tonight's grid process, I think it's really good so long as no one sand bags. And you have to stipulate that if you don't put down a time you're at the back. Like tonight I'm sure I'll be slower than everyone and it will certainly look like I'm sandbagging but I could barely break into the 13s last night.

 

[Kenadian]

I'm not too worried about people sandbagging because around here everyone gets ridiculed for everything. If a Driver continually grids near the front and runs away with the races then we'll know to police that Driver.

It's easy to do too just by looking at the times he's put down via his iRacing profile.

Anyone foolish enough to even try sandbagging will be booted from the League and results removed anyway.

We have a great group of guys here with integrity so this is something of little concern to me.

It does bear mentioning though so it will be added to our nomenclature assuming we stick with this new method of Qualify Gridding.

...

Open setups seem to be working fine as well but we'll still put it to vote at the end of the Season. I personally won't vote given I don't want to influence anyone's decision but overall I'm pleasantly surprised by how well it seems to be working.

 

[Daunt]

I just wanted to point it out because the rule needs to be stated somewhere - not to mention making it obvious that we're on the lookout for it.

Same goes for people who don't put down a time - have to put it and state that they grid behind everyone.

I will say the slight drawback of this way is that those that can't make it for the first practice session are kinda left out to grid at the way back. Still though, I like the idea and would like to try it out a few times at least.

 

[Noodleguitar]

Sounds like a good idea to try out. If someone can't make it in the first session, they don't lose all chances because it's still possible to start from pole in the main race if you're starting from the back in the qualifying race.

This way we're not tied to iRating, which is not a bad ordering system but it does lose some of its power when including people new to iRacing, or those that barely do any official racing.

 

[Fromthenavy]

This way we're not tied to iRating, which is not a bad ordering system but it does lose some of its power when including people new to iRacing, or those that barely do any official racing.

I feel like Ken and i just got singled out real quick :lol:


Excited for tonight, I do like this format as long as honest laps are put down in practice. I have no doubt that there won't be.

 

[Daunt]

So did we establish that we are awarding ken the penalty, so he in fact finished behind me in the qualify race? I am of the mind that yeah it wasn't malicious, but in a league of friends here, zacs approach to setting penalties ensures a blanket coverage of objectivity.

 

[Kenadian]

So did we establish that we are awarding ken the penalty, so he in fact finished behind me in the qualify race? I am of the mind that yeah it wasn't malicious, but in a league of friends here, zacs approach to setting penalties ensures a blanket coverage of objectivity.

As always I'll yield to what you guys think but to be honest I'm not sure how I personally feel about being penalized over our contact.

I simply got loose and collected you which I believe is a racing incident and therefor does not fall within the scope of avoidable contact.

I believe it was Zac who mentioned my car was not under control which is partially correct as I was trying to bring the rear back in. This can be said about anyone trying to gather their car up when the rear slides out.

I was not sideways and don't believe there was anything malicious or avoidable in our contact which is the very definition of avoidable contact.

Again I'll leave it up to you guys to decide but I believe it was a racing incident therefor I don't believe penalizing is just.

 

[Skid_Marc_]

So the way i personally rule accidents:

Avoidable Contact: Say Car 1 divebombs Car 2. Regardless of outcome, Car 1 recieves penalty.

Unavoidable Contact: Car 1 loses control and takes Car 2 out. If both cars continue, no penalty. If Car 1 is damaged (QR Req.), no penalty. If Car 2 is damaged, Car 1 needs to serve a penalty. If both cars are damaged, then both cars will take fast repair.

Indirect Incident: Car 1 spins, Car 2 spins to avoid car one and takes damage. No penalty to either car.

No matter the reason, if Car 1 is directly at fault, then he can not come away from the incident in a better position than Car 2.

 

[Daunt]

I like Zac's simply because it is black and white and there's no need for one person or the other to decide whether or not they want to enforce the penalty.

Like I hate to be the dick that's like "Ken you're getting a penalty for that" know what I mean?

Your unavoidable contact definition, Zac, assumes both cars have a fast repair to spare.

 

[Kenadian]

OK I'll accept that if that's how you guys want to do it but for the record I'm concerned with how difficult this will become to police as grids get larger.

Right now it's not that big of a deal because there's only a few of us but expecting people to accept penalties for situations beyond what iRacing would even consider anything other than a Racing Incident is a can of worms.

As far as I know, what we're proposing even goes beyond what Blancpain suggests is avoidable contact. Blanpain does not police contact unless it's clearly unavoidable which this does contact does not fit into.

What I'm worried about particularly when we start getting larger grids is a Full Pit due to contacts such as the one Kyle and I had as they will be common.

Just imagine Monza in League and the accordion effect with 3 or more cars in Turn 1, Lap 1.

Even Bathurst on the mountain, it's going to be difficult to assess blame there as well particularly in the opening laps.

Again I'll bow to this if you guys want it but I'm not comfortable personally going beyond what I believe iRacing looks for and what Blancpain polices for.

We also assess penalty points based off accumulated incidents, how is this going to work if someone takes penalty points due to being hit under braking, driving off track or spinning to avoid a wreck?

How do we assess fairness?

...and to be clear this is not because it's me being penalized, it's because we're saying any contact at all is a possible penalty. This is racing, there is going to be contact and someone is always going to come out of it worse. I know, I have several times now.

It was an unfortunate incident and yes it happened because I got loose but what we're proposing is a custom rule-set outside of what most iRacers are familiar with: https://www.twitch.tv/bandofothers/v/60831441?t=2h05m28s

 

[Skid_Marc_]

I don't really know what is so hard to police about "If you kill someone, whether because you lost control of your car, or because you made a bad move on track; you get a penalty." You can't just drive off in the sunset with a clear conscience because you "got loose" or it "wasn't intentional", or "oh you broke sooner then I expected" (Monza). And Bathurst is actually what I had in mind when I wrote the that last part. If you spin over the mountain (which is going to happen) and someone spins, stops on track,and then gets crashed into or causes a bigger wreck as cars try to funnel around, that isn't really they're fault that other people got taken out.

I'm not talking about little bumps here, either Ken. When I say damage, it was implied "terminal" or "Meatball" in need of a Quick repair damage.

Good point about the QR, Kyle, but I don't know if we can penalize someone differently just because the car they hit is already without a QR, because that's not something the offending driver can control. Unless of course, they're the ones that forced the driver to take the QR the first time, and then they take them out again..


Again, bottom line, the way I see it you can't benefit from taking someone out. Period.

 

[Jeeve79]

Imo, weird as it may sound, i have to agree with Duke, it is a can of worms u are opening up indeed. Yes it was driver error and I think Ken is aware of that fact and tries to be consistent and clean as best as he can be. He went wide to avoid contact and make room and it bit him in the ass. Does not matter how often he got loose or made contact. Just one error is enough to start arguing, but I thought this was just a fun league with no serious arguments about what is a racing incident or what is driver error.
The most important thing is we all respect each other and show patience and not just barge through as if we own the track. A good rule of thumb is to always give the position back.
U are going to need admins to review incidents and u are going to have people reporting other people about all kinds of incidents and its just going to be a clusterfuck of accusations. I, just as example, got punted from behind at Okayama and did not say a word or call out names and never heard anybody say anything about it, and it is a good thing, because i know it was not intentionally and just a stupid mistake, shit happens, sometimes arguing about it is only going to make it worse. With all the admins and marshalls and reporting and rules and regulations in the world, shit is still going to happen. I would just say in this case Ken, learn from your mistakes and keep focus on consistency and clean racing. I know u already doing this that is why i am on your side. Leave the can of worms closed for now, until we really get wreckers and crashers that keep screwing up everybody's race.

In the meantime, enjoy my vid of the Sonoma race here:
[video=youtube;U_m6lyXTDrY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_m6lyXTDrY[/video]