Battlefield 4 opinions after nearly a week.

little P

Super Mod
I haven't seen anything on the forum regarding battlefield 4. Either everyone is too busy playing it and having a great time or there's some other reason, but I wanted to ask, what are your opinions after having got some decent playing time with it?

I've been looking around the web trying to decide whether to pick a code up or not and so far the reports haven't been good... This page for example collates some of the videos on you tube I've seen.

I was only considering getting it on PC as I've played it on both 360 and PS3 round a couple of mates houses and frankly, it looked shite. Really bad framerate drops and 24 player multiplayer for a game of this scale is laughable, it can be a long time before you see anyone on some of the maps even with a full server.

So, anyway, what are your thoughts? :)
 

Kenadian

Staff member
Site Admin
I'm just over 27 hours into Battlefield 4 but I'm not sure if that includes the Singleplayer Campaign which is about 4 or 5 hours depending on whether or not you try to find the hidden unlocks?

I know I'll be playing for hundreds if not thousands of hours to come because the game is simply amazing. Yes it has issues but it is easily the best looking (and sounding) Multiplayer FPS of all time. Most of the maps included are a lot of fun and exceptionally well designed.

I've even sniped a few times and actually enjoyed it which is something that never happened in Battlefield 3.

Battlefield 4 Singleplayer:

First off, I think the Battlefield 4 Singleplayer is sh1t and I only played it for the unlocks. It's a horrible story with uninteresting characters, wooden dialogue and completely unrealistic combat situations. Sure it looks great overall but there are some good videos on YouTube that demonstrate just how poor the experience can be such as this one by Nerdᶟ:

[video=youtube;VXUERB2fxN4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXUERB2fxN4[/video]

If you get it for Singleplayer then it's a complete waste of both time and money but since you're in it for Multiplayer then I'll just move on.

Battlefield 4 Pros:

Gunplay in Battlefield 4 is simply awesome and far better than in Battlefield 3, hands down. Weapons feel a bit more weighty and the sound design just makes the shooting of each weapon type feel more authentic than in Battlefield 3.

Vehicles are also well done and tanks actually feel a bit better balanced this time around. Gunboats are also incredibly awesome and I love driving them although there quite a handful when the ocean kicks up like in Paracel Storm.

The weapon/vehicle unlock system in Battlefield 3 has been completely redone so now you start off with capable weaponry in the beginning and need far fewer kills to upgrade them. You can also get unlocks through Battlepacks but there random so you can't count on them to help you upgrade your favorite weapon type.

Overall the game is vastly superior to Battlefield 3 in virtually every category if you compare launched states. Most people seem to forget that Battlefield 3 was sh1t at launch too and are primarily comparing Battlefield 4's launch state to Battlefield 3's final state.

Battlefield 4 Cons:

Are there issues, oh ya, and lots of them!!!

Large maps seem to have horrid sound issues where you can go for large periods of time with no sound or only a few of your own soldiers sounds. Apparently there is a fix being worked on but this should never have been an issue upon release.

There's also a bug where apparently attaching a silencer to one particular weapon can mute sound for everyone on the Server:

[video=youtube;OZ7ZXe6nOsE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZ7ZXe6nOsE#t=142[/video]

...ridiculous.

The spawn system is still utter sh1t as you can easily spawn in front of enemies only to get immediately mowed down. Why they can't fix this is beyond me because there are numerous spawn locations for each flag but it's still just as poor as it was in Battlefield 3.

Although Server crashing seems to have been addressed, all of us have been hit with crashes at some stage which you get no stats from at all. Client crashes mean you lose nothing however Server crashes mean all the stats gained during that round are gone.

I had one particular game where I was lighting it up with a 10-0 KDR only to have the Server crash and lose those stats forever as well as upgrades, unlocks, etc.

The other thing that is still an issue is the Playerbase who just have no clue about what a Team Game really is.

To support the Team you MUST be proficient at more than one role and not be afraid to switch it up if the situation calls for it.

I've teased Smack about this endlessly (sorry Smack) but the fact is, you are useless as an Engineer on a map with no vehicles. You need to be packing either motion sensors, defibs/med packs and/or ammo bags to help your Team.

Battlefield is a Team Game and if you can't PTFO (which means much more than just shooting in the right direction) then you're not playing for the Team. If you have med kits, drop them everywhere; likewise for ammo bags.

People can't shoot if their out of ammo or dead, seriously, it's common sense which is sadly uncommon in this game.

Squad Leaders still have no idea how to call objectives much of the time either. What they don't realize is they miss out on so many points by not calling objectives and it breaks the Squad up.

These remain the most irritating aspect of the Battlefield Series.

Battlefield 4 Netcode and other issues:

On to Netcode and this is a tough one because some people are bitching about it just because they can but not all claims are valid (such as in the link you provided). It's very hard to determine what is a Netcode issue, what is a bug and what is caused by client, all of which are present and probably always will be to some extent.

I've emptied a clip into a guy only to have him turn and kill me because none of my hits registered and I'm sure we all have. However frustrating it is (and it is frustrating), it happens very rarely and if it's enough to make you rage then you're already having a bad day and should prolly Alt + F4.

I've also been shot around corners because I clearly got into cover later on the other guys monitor than on my own and these are both likely Netcode situations.

That being said, I saw a guy last night score 40-8 on a ping of 267ms, wtf? The best Netcode in the world isn't going to help this situation because this guy just isn't sending packets in a timely enough manner to the Server. The only thing that helps this is a ping limit at the Server end of 150ms or lower.

In fact I was on a European Server with Johnny and D.O.A. and scored a KDR of 2 or 3 to 1; I can't remember precisely. I had a good round and got the jump on many of my enemies but I'm sure my 180ms+ ping saved my ass a few times as well; it had to have. I was turning and burning on guys that should have taken me out without issue and I don't think that should have happened.

The beta seemed better in this regard but I don't remember seeing high pings either. Of course I saw plenty of 100ms+ but nothing over 200ms, not even close. I honestly believe this is one of the biggest issues especially when there are a few higher ping players on the Server which is common.

Now, I've encountered times where I'm emptying a clip into someone but nothing is registering and that's because there's a bloody invisible barrier between my enemy and me. With all the "Levolution" bs in this game, this is something that happens from time to time as well.

Battlefield 4 "Levolution":

As for Levolution, it's the most irritating gimmick I've ever experienced. Yes it's cool to have the map change but it's a controlled change and it happens under the same variables every single time. Anyone who thinks it's dynamic is a fool, it's only marginally more variable than the smoke stack on Caspian Border in Battlefield 3; only because it's usually Player controlled.

I love Paracel Storm, in fact it's my favorite map to date however the storm blows in way too quickly. There's little to no transition in the weather, it goes from mostly flat calm to typhoon in under 30 seconds which is just stupid.

Battlefield 4 Community:

Then there's the "hacking" because apparently everyone who is better than you is a hacker. Smack and I know a guy who always complains about hacking. It got so bad recently that I challenged him on it as he was complaining about being sniped by a Rex Handgun.

When questioned we learned the guy that killed him had a score of 8-5; hardly a hacker I'd wager. If so, he needs to learn how to use the hack or just purchase a better one because his BF4 hack sucks.

I find it amazing how fickle the Battlefield Community is in general because many are just whiny pussies. They say "go back to COD" yet turn on each other when their outgunned.

It's pathetic.

40-1 as Infantry (hacker), 40-1 as a Chopper Gunner or Jet Pilot (legitimate).

Battlefield 3 vs Battlefield 4:

Battlefield 4 is just more difficult than Battlefield 3, period. I think whats made it tougher is the sheer amount of choices you have in customizing your loadouts. Every attachment makes a difference so it's imperative you customize your loadout to match your play style and not because some YouTuber told you it's the best like LevelCap ALWAYS does.

Even Symthic won't help you if you're using a beast loadout on a kit you can't control. You need to play the role that works best for you and it takes a long time to find what that loadout is; perhaps months so patience is required which most gamers don't seem to have.

Map design is also playing a large role in why we die so much because we can be shot from anywhere at anytime. It's sometimes impossible to determine where you're being shot from and quite often it's from numerous angles of exposure.

In Conclusion:

Now why I think this game is more challenging is simple, I'm having a hard time with it and I know my friends are as well. I believe I'm a slightly above average player and I have a KDR of 2.13 meaning for every 2.13 kills I die once.

I ended off Battlefield 3 at an average of 3 or perhaps 4 to 1 much of the time so I know I'm struggling a bit; so are ALL my friends.

I have 99 friends currently, many of which are Competition Level players from prominent teams such as Shot Docs, Velocity Raptors, V2, Nexus, LOVE, AXIOM, and of course the now defunct TeamReddit.

Of all my friends, I'm in 9th place with a KDR of 2.13. I shouldn't even be in the Top 10 because of the level of play that many of my friends have which means their struggling too.


ShotDoc_Darius is a 2.79 and he's in a Tank all the time, wtf? I'm only second to him in Tank stats but I play far more Infantry than he does so I can see he's struggling a bit. VR-BIGMAC is actually 1337-BigMac and he's easily one of the best players I've ever seen and he's only a 2.47 currently.

...

Is Battlefield4 for you, maybe?

You have to be honest with yourself and that's not easy for everyone to do.

You're going to die more than you did in Battlefield 3 so get used to it. Yes you will improve over time but you're going to have to work at it.

You're also going to need a deep well of patience as it goes through the bug fixing process which we all know from Battlefield 3 takes forever. If this is enough for you to not load the game during this time then I would suggest not getting the game at all as with Premium it will cost you over $100 total.

I'd go as far to say that if you didn't get over 100 hours out of Battlefield 3 then you shouldn't even bother with Battlefield 4 because you'll regret the decision IMHO. Yes there have been upgrades but it's pretty much the same engine under the hood.

If you loved Battlefield 3 and want to experience it again however much more flushed out then you need to purchase Battlefield 4. If you spent more time irritated than enjoying Battlefield 3 then I'd pass personally.
 
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Wow! Thanks for the awesome writeup, Duke. I can't speak for little P, but I really appreciate it.

From the sound of it, I'm not sure if I'll ever get the game. I know Dice's history with patches (taking FOREVER to get stuff out that really should just be a hotfix, leaving glaring balance issues in place for ages, etc.). I still remember when the M26 DART glitch came up in BF3 and it took 'em, like, a month or two to fix it. I don't look forward to the same process, particularly not when I'd be paying ~$100 for the privilege.

I also didn't play much of premium, actually. I basically stopped playing BF3 when Armored Kill came out. I'd grown tired of the standard maps, and the Armored Kill maps at launch had some real balance problems with the AC130, at least in Rush mode (my preferred mode). I also LOATHED the unlock progression in that game. It was a real drag. Anyway, I found that I really didn't get my money's worth on Premium with BF3. My own decision, but the experience just got old for me.

I also find myself with less consistent time to play these kinds of games anymore. I have time to game, but it's always pretty irregular, so I rarely find myself online when lots of my friends list is on. Thus, I end up playing on my own, dealing with pub teams who can't PTFO. I love how the BF series does its best to promote teamplay, but JESUS these people never seem to get that concept. They'd rather just grind kills on Metro (which I did, too, but only to get weapons so I could go play the real game). The other thing is, by the time the game would be fully patched up, I expect everyone would be leagues ahead of me in terms of unlocks and such. I hate that crap and it'd necessitate buying weapon packs, which also irritates me.


I think, basically, that my time in these kinds of grind-oriented games is simply past me. I love teamplay, but I hate unlocks. That's all anyone plays anymore, though, so I guess I'll stick with mostly single-player or co-op games.
 
I will admit that I love how they've changed the classes to make them all more useful. That's a big plus. I'm just not sure I'd get my money's worth this time around. Maybe if there's a sale in the not-too-distant future.
 

Kenadian

Staff member
Site Admin
I will admit that I love how they've changed the classes to make them all more useful. That's a big plus. I'm just not sure I'd get my money's worth this time around. Maybe if there's a sale in the not-too-distant future.
You might see a few dollars off at Christmas but I'd wager it won't be much assuming it even happens.

I will say though that the weapon unlock progression is actually quite good. It's only 10 kills to get a useful scope more often than not and that's easy to attain.

As for everyone else being better than you assuming you purchase later, that's not much of an issue really. You can hammer it out in a few meat grinder maps and level up 2 classes in a matter of hours in the beginning. If you manage to Squad Up then you'll be amazed at how quickly you level up initially.

Being part of a Squad also means you get a lot of collateral damage as well. You don't have to kill a guy to get a kill, you only have to injure him up to a certain %. I think it's actually a pretty good system however I can't confirm if collateral kills actually count toward weapon leveling stats.

Going back to Armored Kill though, I agree with you totally. I wanted that Expansion to be awesome but it was the worst second only to Close Quarters.

That being said, Aftermath was awesome!!!

This is Battlefield and as such, they try and make something for everyone. I hate some of the maps with a passion but it's more about playing with my friends than the map so I typically grind through and just focus on improving.

However I have the time and desire to do so, if you don't then passing is really the best option IMHO.
 

Wotan

Hardcore
I played BF3 over a hundred hours until I got bored. Happend in the BF4 beta within an hour, so I'll pass on this one.
 

Kitlope

Hardcore
Nice write up Duke and I agree with all points. Right now as it stands there's some bugs and such but will get patched up so I'm not worried. This game isn't going away anytime soon. It's not perfect but in all honesty it will eventually be close.

I love this game, IMO the best Bf since 1942. Hands down. There's so many little touches that they brought back from past Battlefield games that I really dig. For instance:

1. Five Man squads have returned and it's about damn time.

2. The chat is actually effective and you can chat as the next map loads, which helps to "personalize" the game and can "rub elbows" with other players. Or you can just call them all fucking morons while you have their undivided attention just before the next map loads.

3. Positional Audio is excellent (and audio in general) It's been since Battlefield: Vietnam the last time positional audio was good, I always found BF2, Bad Company 2 and BF3 to be very lousy... was always hard to judge the distance of whatever noise you heard and could be very misleading and get you killed. In BF4 stuff is easy to locate, great dynamic range too... overall the audio is by far the best in any BF game, sounds of weapons, vehicles etc. A big plus. A nice pair of Sennheiser 600's headphones and this game would sing like d000ks fat lady.

4. Local Radio Keys seem to work well, much better than BC2 and BF3. Much easier and efficient to communicate with squad and team. I just wish they brought back the "taunt" key, loved using it before knifing some n00b.

5.Pace of the game to me is perfect. Not too fast, not too slow. I found BC2 & BF3 a little too fast.

6. BF3 only awed me with the graphics. BF4 awes me with much better graphics and the much improved gameplay. It's the best of both worlds and I'm loving it.

There's more but that's all I can think of at the moment.

Pick it up Little P, I think you'll really like it.
 
You might see a few dollars off at Christmas but I'd wager it won't be much assuming it even happens.

I will say though that the weapon unlock progression is actually quite good. It's only 10 kills to get a useful scope more often than not and that's easy to attain.

As for everyone else being better than you assuming you purchase later, that's not much of an issue really. You can hammer it out in a few meat grinder maps and level up 2 classes in a matter of hours in the beginning. If you manage to Squad Up then you'll be amazed at how quickly you level up initially.

Being part of a Squad also means you get a lot of collateral damage as well. You don't have to kill a guy to get a kill, you only have to injure him up to a certain %. I think it's actually a pretty good system however I can't confirm if collateral kills actually count toward weapon leveling stats.

Going back to Armored Kill though, I agree with you totally. I wanted that Expansion to be awesome but it was the worst second only to Close Quarters.

That being said, Aftermath was awesome!!!

This is Battlefield and as such, they try and make something for everyone. I hate some of the maps with a passion but it's more about playing with my friends than the map so I typically grind through and just focus on improving.

However I have the time and desire to do so, if you don't then passing is really the best option IMHO.
Yeah, I mean, I spent a bunch of time in BF3, but my schedule and life were quite a bit different at that point. I might go for it at some point, but at the moment, I have TONS of games to play through (many purchased through Humble Bundles and Steam sales). Probably best to wait for the time being.
 

little P

Super Mod
Duke, could you elaborate a bit? ;)

Nah, thanks guys, really great feedback. I think I will pick it up at the end of the month, hopefully everybody won't be too far ahead. I miss shooting the shit with you all so hopefully this will be one I can get invested in. :) And by then all the worst bugs will be patched (hopefully)
 

Kenadian

Staff member
Site Admin
Quite honestly, the issues with the game annoy me a lot less than the player base. BF has always been a n00bcentric game and it only gets more and more obvious with each new game.

It's getting to the point now where I only want to play on Servers where I know friends are on as it makes it far more tolerable than just hopping into a game with a bunch of random scrubs.
 

Wapwap

Staff member
Admin
Nice writeup Duke!

I still haven't got around to install my copy though. Is anyone playing today?
 

Kenadian

Staff member
Site Admin
I'll definitely be playing today but I don't think it will be around the time you and I normally hook up. I have things to do today so I'll be out most of the afternoon.
 

little P

Super Mod
Well, I picked it up for 29 space credits and am downloading it now, so look out for the jedi tard to be ruining it for everyone else in a server near you soon
 

JohnnyK

Hardcore
As a note, multiple videos have now conclusively shown that there is a one-hit-kill bug in the game. Speculation ranges from hits being counted twice to issues with healing etc.

[video=youtube;3vDOC1V6GM8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vDOC1V6GM8[/video]
[video=youtube;0dGROUSkbDU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dGROUSkbDU[/video]

Maybe jackfrags posting about it will make DICE acknowlege and fix this asap...
 

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