B2O/Practice Pals League R&D

[Kenadian]

...actually, I'm not even going to wait until the weekend to display future races.

 

[CafeHolay]

I ran an official race last night... qualified with a 1:16.9xx... felt pretty comfortable in the BMW there. Did pretty good but about 6 laps in, screwed up braking for turn 2 (Does that turn have a name? the downhill left hander?) and swung around and hit the inside... took 10 minutes in repairs. Ruined what would have been a pretty good race for me. That turn is real real tough. I brake a bit early, but I feel like if I wait for the crest to brake it's too late.

BoP-wise, the cars seem to be much better balanced now. So this would seem to indicate this is a strong track for the BMW. Pretty sad that on it's strong track they're pretty even.

I kinda was quick to adapt to the car track combo only because I've driven the actual track. Unfortunately waiting to feel the bump to hit the brakes in turn three and looking for references that just aren't part of the sim are still being worked out.

I'm a solid 1:19.2xx using the first setup I could find that passed and haven't tweaked. I'll probably make the 16's tonight when I actually work on being faster.

Turn 2 is Clayton Corner.

....
Turn 1 has no name that I know
2: Clayton Corner
3: Quebec Corner
4-5-6 All part off Moss Corner named for Sterling Moss
Back Straight: Mario Andretti Straightaway (Best opportunity to pass, getting a good exit on 7 is key)
8-9: The Esses ... Dunno why they spell it like that. Maybe a Canadian Thing
10: White's Corner

Possibly a good cheat sheet if you don't know the track well: http://trillium-bmwclub.ca/content/mosport-old-track-info-page

Kinda wish the Mosport Speedway 1/2 mile had have been added to iracing ... imho

 

[Daunt]

Thank you Cafe. Thought about coming there for the PWC. Would be a decent drive for me, about 5-6 hours.

And Ken, next week is Motegi... NIGHT. SO AWESOME! :icon_cheesygrin: B-)
Defintely want to run another session next week but I believe Zac had his Nascar at RA scheduled for Friday night again.

 

[Slider]

First downhill left is turn 3.

Turn 1 has no name that I know
2: Clayton Corner
3: Quebec Corner
4-5-6 All part off Moss Corner named for Sterling Moss
Back Straight: Mario Andretti Straightaway (Best opportunity to pass, getting a good exit on 7 is key)
8-9: The Esses ... Dunno why they spell it like that. Maybe a Canadian Thing
10: White's Corner

Mostly correct, but last turn is spelled: Whites corner.
Esses are spelled correctly as well. It's not a Canadian thing.
Numbers are also wrong, but I can't find the correct map. Guy that races there told me.

Just a 16.9 is worthless without event results as weather is dynamic and people in my races were in 14s for Q and 15s in race.

 

[Daunt]

Just a 16.9 is worthless without event results as weather is dynamic and people in my races were in 14s for Q and 15s in race.

Right. And I'm no alien. Just to give a rough idea of times. Obviously not something super useful anymore.

 

[Slider]

Weather is definitely variable this week.

Race 1:
http://members.iracing.com/membersite/member/EventResult.do?&subsessionid=14420158&custid=166318

Race 2:
http://members.iracing.com/membersite/member/EventResult.do?&subsessionid=14423467&custid=166318

 

[CafeHolay]

Sneak peak at the paint I'll be running this week. Work in progress.

 

[Kenadian]

Nice start Cafe

I ran 11 laps tonight on a Spa set (it was all I had lol) with race fuel and managed a PB of 1:17.860 on Lap 10 with no draft. In this weather I can probably hit 1:17.500 but that's pushing it I think.

Pretty respectable start I think given I've run 11 laps total so far this week.

The best time in session was a 1:17.024 set by a Ruf.

Weather:

• Clear 26ºC, Track 41ºC
• Winds S/SE 3-5 km/hr
• Relative Humidity 76%

 

[Noodleguitar]

I'm in on friday! That is, if they stop ddos-ing my internet provider.

I don't think we can fix the fuel that someone can put in during a pit stop but there shouldn't much room to change the amount. If the starting fuel get's you about 55-60% through the race you will need to take maybe 80-95% of the original starting fuel in the pit stop to make it to the finish.

One administrative problem I could see is how we check if somebody takes tires or not. Pit stops can vary a little with optional/required damage or penalties. So if we look at the in-lap and out-lap times it will not always be clear if somebody changed tires or not.

 

[Daunt]

As I said, The fuel amounts (and refill rates) are balanced so I'm not worried about it at all.

I agree with you on the tires. Though in Blancpain, unlike V8, you cannot refuel AND change tires, so pit stops are a bit longer and it is much more noticeable. Plus with an enforced pit window, it's not like we have to search through a whole race.

Though the rules need to be clarified on this pit window. Because pitting early due to damage seems to kinda be a loophole. I'm not sure how the official rules are, but we might need to make adjustments. I can't remember if we decided on a quick repair but that would obviously come into play too.

 

[Noodleguitar]

Pitting early won't be possible if we limit the fuel to an equivalent of 35 minutes. If somebody pits before 25 minutes, he can't finish because the fuel restriction is still in effect so he'll only be able to add 35 minutes worth.

 

[Daunt]

So far my [limited] experience with the new Official Blancpain Sprint Series format, it seems that, at least for the BMW, I start full fuel (14 gallons) and I'm putting in a bit short of ~10 gallons to make the full race (40 minutes) average, depending on track. 14 gallons is 46%, which is the standard this season.

The ideal spot is to be short of 2 full tanks so that there's no need to fiddle with the percentage due to the track we're racing. I think if we do somewhere in the realm of 55% give or take 5%, we are right at that point for a 55 minute race. We obviously want some wiggle room, so I think 55% is a good number to start with and will use that for tomorrow's race.

If I remember correctly, they're balanced to run about 65 minutes on a full tank. So at 55%, that means they're at a tad over 35 minutes. Honestly I think that is a good starting point.

 

[Daunt]

I was also real busy last night and did not have time to make the official league session. My apologies. I will do it later today for sure.

 

[Kenadian]

Though the rules need to be clarified on this pit window. Because pitting early due to damage seems to kinda be a loophole. I'm not sure how the official rules are, but we might need to make adjustments. I can't remember if we decided on a quick repair but that would obviously come into play too.

This is indeed a potential loop hole but not one I'd put energies into considering because after all, these are closed sessions.

If the League is as Social as I'm aiming for, we won't have dodgy idiots in it trying to take advantage of this sort of thing.

...but mistakes can happen which can bring this issue to light.

There are two ways around it that I can see. Either we offer 1 Quick Repair and penalize the driver for using it via a drive through penalty on the next lap or don't off quick repairs.

Regardless of whether or not a Quick Repair is taken, they still must Pit inside the Pit Window for the simulated driver change. In this case they'd still need to take tires which should balance things out.

If the Quick Repair is taken after the Pit Window then there is no issue.

 

[CafeHolay]

Used Mecca for sale ... iRacing won't take it back.

I spent 2 hours trying different throttle points, different braking points, different brake bias, brake frictions ... and all lead to the same conclusion. Do what the frickin car wants or end up in the grass.

To be fair, I find driving this I am almost always mashing the throttle or completely off of it and have no feel for finenessing acceleration/deceleration with it. Coupled with absolutely no sense of body roll or reaching a grip limit ... I flat out have no feel for the car. It just seems to be a very tedious car to drive and is likely untouchable if you have it figured out ... but a roadblock when you don't.

I honestly wish there was a way through the pedal you could sense the ABS was active.

There just seems to be no warning you are approaching the limits of the car, or means to gather it back up if you overdo it a little.

I'm going to turn some laps in the BMW to see if it's a little more forgiving as far as having to be OCD for hitting marks and corner entry speeds.

 

[Daunt]

Sounds like you need to fiddle more with throttle mapping and ABS settings, and possibly TC settings as well. Have you tried that?

The Macca is pretty unforgiving and tough to learn to drive, but it sounds like you're missing out on a few things.

 

[Kenadian]

You have a number of people here who feel you pain. I've been complaining about this for a while now and aside from Noel, pretty much everyone else seems to agree.

Noel is an alien though so I don't count his feedback

The problem for me is I love the car and think it's one of the most enjoyable in all of iRacing, BUT, it has a tendency to just take off from under you with no warning.

I had it spin at both COTA and Road Atlanta (75 minute race). Both times I could see why it happened (in replay and YouTube Video) however I'm perplexed as to why it mostly let me get away with it?

Then there was Sonoma where I had both Kyle and Justin Brunner watching my race via Twitch; both were concerned about how I was driving it. This with good reason, I was driving like an animal, hopping curbs and a lot of heavy, imbalanced braking.

No issues whatsoever aside from late run understeer.

The feel you get through the steering wheel is amazing and you get to feel every nuance in the road. It's a beautiful car that sounds awesome but it has a tendency to want to kill you and you never know when.

Even if you are afforded a microseconds notice, there's oftentimes nothing you can do about it.

I find myself wondering how a mid engine car (for the most part) with fuel cell behind the driver can seem so imbalanced sometimes?

Surely this can't be real?

...but then I realize it's not the most popular car in real life Blancpain, maybe this is the reason why?

 

[Daunt]

Since my short time switching to BMW, I really love it. I loved the Macca, but the consistency I can achieve in the BMW is amazing. The big difference is that I know why exactly I lose control of the BMW. The Macca can be just weird sometimes and I have no idea what caused my loss of control.

 

[CafeHolay]

Since my short time switching to BMW, I really love it. I loved the Macca, but the consistency I can achieve in the BMW is amazing. The big difference is that I know why exactly I lose control of the BMW. The Macca can be just weird sometimes and I have no idea what caused my loss of control.

So change of plans for the race tonight. I'll be running the BMW, the paint on the macca is just for vanity at this point.

I can see some of the things everyone enjoys the BMW for. In my case ... body movement. I know that sounds odd, but being able to notice weight tranfer is a HUGE thing for me to determine my line. picking up more than 1.5 seconds in the first segment of the track simply by being able to get interpretable feedback from the car ... priceless.

Unfortunately the 30 minute practice tonight will be the only chance to fine tune things and know how the car will dive as the run goes on. But my wheel will at least still be on the desk by the end of an hour driving it.

@Daunt : The whole idea of messing with TC/ABS/Mapping are moot points for a fixed setup race. But if there are resources on the different engine mapping curves by setting that would be amazing if they exist.

Suggestion for gridding: I'm going to make the suggestion knowing that I could be one of the people who may fall into the group ... but maybe the bottom 5-10% of the field should be at the back for the race. It takes the pressure off of trying not to "be that guy" who wrecks the fastest cars in the field because their time or speed at a given track is a larger gap.

I think it should only come into play though if there is a significant gap in times though. I've seen half the field get wrecked out because someone was trying to keep out of the way of the faster cars.

 

[Daunt]

@Daunt : The whole idea of messing with TC/ABS/Mapping are moot points for a fixed setup race. But if there are resources on the different engine mapping curves by setting that would be amazing if they exist.

Suggestion for gridding: I'm going to make the suggestion knowing that I could be one of the people who may fall into the group ... but maybe the bottom 5-10% of the field should be at the back for the race. It takes the pressure off of trying not to "be that guy" who wrecks the fastest cars in the field because their time or speed at a given track is a larger gap.

I think it should only come into play though if there is a significant gap in times though. I've seen half the field get wrecked out because someone was trying to keep out of the way of the faster cars.

good point on the fixed setup. You're right about that. That is honestly the reason I dislike fixed. (I know we're not having that discussion here, just saying). It's not really a matter of speed, it's a matter of comfort and finding a setup that suits your driving style.

As for gridding you have a good point as well. I've already set the grid for the qualify race to be reverse gridded based on iRating. It's just a 15 qualify race, not a full race, and there will be a quick repair in the official race. But maybe next time we can do something else as well.